Alchemy......Insider's Secrets

METAL CONVERSION METHODS

2019-12-03T11:49:21-05:00

METAL CONVERSION METHODS

As long as a clients specification don't prohibit it, be creative when faced with a tough sourcing problem. Here are a few ideas for alternate ways of supplying hard to find materials.

BAR PRODUCTS

Round Bar

Forge it
Turn it from a larger diameter
Cut from plate - if the finished lengths are short and plate is available at that thickness
Upset it to make larger diameters from smaller ones - only in short lengths

Square Bar

Cut from plate
Hot roll it from round or flat bar - conversion
Forge it
Mill it from round bar
Saw cut from round bar

Hex

Forge it, if lengths are short
Mill it from round bar

Flat Bar

Cut from plate
Forge it
Mill it from round bar
Saw cut from round bar

FLAT ROLLED PRODUCTS

Sheet

Mill or grind it from heavier sheet or plate
Get it slit and cut to length from strip coil
If aluminum or titanium, chemically mill it

Plate

Mill it from heavier sheet or plate

TUBULAR PRODUCTS

Seamless Tube & Pipe

Forge It, if lengths are short
Bore It
Trepann it
Centrifugally cast it
Flow form it

Welded Tube & Pipe

Offer seamless, if available
Roll and weld plate or sheet - over 2" OD
Custom draw it - under 2" OD

Square & Rectangular Tube

Re-square it from round tube (Louisiana Steel)

REMEMBER - Alternates often come down to a trade-off between cost, time, quality, etc....

While many of these alternatives can be done by your suppliers, ie..many have in-house milling, grinding, saw cutting, waterjet, etc.....many require an understanding of an entirely new subset of service suppliers - companies who can bore, trepann, forge, roll & weld and more.

MBA will give you the forge shops, but here is a valuable list of service providers to do the rest

Utilizing these options can be a time consuming process, requiring you to contact and negotiate with multiple vendors, with varying chances of actually winning the job.

Metal Sourcing - An Introduction

2019-12-03T11:30:23-05:00

Sourcing is an Art

Most inquiries you get will be easy - check stock and quote OR, log on to MSO, find suppliers, send an email or call to get prices, markup and quote. This will probably represent 80-90% of the RFQ's you see. The other 10-20% are potential opportunities, but it takes skill to decide whether or not they are profitable opportunities.

Anyone can source metal - it takes a true master to profitably run down the tough ones.

The truest definition of a master sourcing professional is a person who intuitively knows when to take the time to quote an alternative. Developing that intuition takes time as well as a sense of just what can and can't be reliably produced to meet a clients needs.

Keys to Outsourcing Success

Round Bar is NOT Round Bar, Pipe is NOT Pipe

A round bar is nothing more than a solid cylindrical piece of metal, pipe is nothing more than a cylinder with a hole in it. When facing a challenging sourcing challenge, be creative and think of how that round bar or pipe can be produced - forging, sawing, grinding, casting, etc....

Study & Learn the Alternate Production Methods

Becoming a sourcing pro takes time and effort. The best of the best know intuitively just what is and is not possible. Make the time to learn each and every process - what sizes can be economically produced by an open die forge shop, centrifugal caster, precision saw cutting company, etc.

I HIGHLY recommend a physical visit to one of these companies to fully understand how they operate and what they can do to make you a better out-sourcing pro.

Ask Lots of Questions

Deciding which RFQ's are worth pursuing is key. The only way to make the right decision is to get as much information as possible.

If the customer asks for a 12" round bar and the maximum available in the industry is 6", ask how long his parts are, how many he's making, what specification he needs it certified to and how much time he has - could this be cut from plate?, Forged to size?

If the client wants 24" OD welded tubing and the maximum stock size is 20", again, what’s the spec, cut length, required lead time - this could be rolled and welded, if plate is available at the wall thickness he requires, it could be centrifugally cast if the wall thickness is too heavy for plate, it could be forged as a mandrel ring - if the ID is tiny in relation to the OD, could it be bored from a solid round bar?

Learn When to Say No

It really comes down to pre-qualifying the client as well as the RFQ. Here are some client pre-qualification questions:

Is this a client that you know?

Do they buy from you regularly?

Does the client have an order to place and if yes, how did they initially quote the job if the metal in question is simply not available from stock?

Does the client have a shut-down or AOG (aircraft on the ground) situation?

SRM

As important as CRM is to a winning relationship with a client, SRM (Supplier Relationship Management) is equally important.

Develop a solid, friendly relationship with a specific person at each supplier company and try to only deal with that person. Document conversations, their likes and dislikes, any information that you can to build the relationship - especially important if you only contact that company occasionally. What sports teams do they like, hobbies, etc....all very important

Prequalifying a Buyout Opportunity

2019-04-29T12:27:59-04:00

Every time we get an inquiry for a non-stock item, we must make a decision.....do we regret or do we go for it? The decision should be based on a variety of factors which, for the experienced sales professional, has become a matter of muscle memory.

For the beginner or, as a brush up for more experienced salespeople, here is a quick guide to help you make the decision....

Pre-Qual Methodology

If the RFQ is received by email, it will often be tough to answer all the questions, but over the phone, we can develop a series of simple unobtrusive questions that will help us develop a score for the requirement.

Pre-Qual Decision Making Questions:

The Customer - Are They....

Repeat/ return customer – add 20 points

New, small customer – add 1 points

Another metals distributor - subtract 5 points

New/ Notable (GE, ITT, Lockheed, Boeing, etc...) – add 5 points

Purchasing Agent or buyer – add 5 points

Engineer – add 10 points

Student – subtract 5 points

From the Middle East – Iran, Israel, Turkey or former Soviet Union countries – subtract 10 points

Notes: In order to score this section, you will have to ask questions of the buyer and probably Google their company

The Metal, is it.....

In stock with one of our best suppliers? - add 5 points

Common grade and form (More than 20 distributors stock it) – subtract 5 points

Odd Size - add 5 points

Odd Grade – add 5 points

Odd Form – add 5 points

Notes: To score this section, you will need to run the RFQ in the MSO database. Take care to consider whether or not we can cut, open die forge, bore or otherwise fabricate what the client needs especially if their score from section 1 or 3 are high. IE – return customer or notable, with a rush requirement.

=====================================================

The Delivery Required.....

Need it yesterday/ plant shutdown/ AOG – add 10 points

Just quoting – subtract 5 points

Notes: AOG is an aircraft industry term that means Aircraft on the Ground – essentially an emergency situation.

Pre-Qual Scoring

0-10....REGRET

11-25....MAYBE IF YOU'RE NOT TOO BUSY

26-40......LOOKS GOOD

41-60.....SLAM DUNK!!!! GO FOR IT!!!

This method can and will be tweaked by you and your sales manager and team. It represents a framework that you can use to build an in-house system of prequalification to optimize the time spent and profitability of buyouts.

****Making Seamless Tubing .......From Round Bar

2018-03-16T10:29:31-04:00

This morning I had the chance to help a newcomer to the field of metals learn a new trick.....turning solid round bar into seamless tubing.

The RFQ called for 4340, 3" OD x 1.50" ID x 32" lengths - 4 pieces. Since this size does not exist in the marketplace, I recommended boring stock 3" round bar.

The first step is to locate the round bar matching the tube OD required...in this case, the company actually had 3" in stock. Calculate the cost of the round bar and get a price for boring, add freight and quote the job.

Here are a few good choices. We like Timken Boring for quick service, great pricing and fast quote turnaround. Feel free to add your favorites in the comments section.

Also remember, some distributors offer in-house boring and trepanning (trepaning is useful on larger ID's from solid as it reclaims a solid, reusable ID core).

Alloy Machining Services, Inc
2808 Supply Ave.
Los Angeles, CA
(323) 726-8248
info@alloymachiningservices.com

AMS is a great boring and honing shop. OD turning capabilities 40" diameter x 30' Long.ID Boring capabilities up to 36" diameter x 30'.

Custom Honing, Inc.
24840 U.S. 20 West
South Bend, IN
800-311-9468

steve@customhoning.com

Boring from 8" through 24" up to 14' long. Honing from .75" to 44" up to 64 feet long.

EDCO Drilling & Honing
661 S Main St
Webster, MA
(508) 671-9921

Edco is a regional deep hole drilling operation.

Hunting Dearborn
8 6 Dearborn Drive
Fryeburg, ME
207.935.2171

Hunting is a fabulous trepanning shop located in Maine. They do work for every major producer in the US, specializing in long lengths, close tolerances and exotic metals including SS, Superalloy and Titanium.

Magorien Boring
1212 South Vail Avenue
Montebello, CA
323.726.4000
info@magorien.com

In business since 1958, Magorien Honing & Hydraulics is unique in being able to offer the manufacturing industry over 50 years of experience in precision I.D. honing, Deep hole boring, Gun drilling, hydraulic press building, modification & repair as well as complete rebuilding of hydraulic cylinders.

Quality Grinding Company, Inc.
6800 Caballero Blvd.
Buena Park, CA
714-228-2100
Sales@QualityGrinding.Net

Quality Grinding offers blanchard, surface, OD/ ID centerless and way grinding. Additionally, they offer general machine shop services including milling, drilling, horizontal ID boring and cutoff sawing.

Roberts Honing & Gundrilling
12805 Sunshine Avenue
Santa Fe Springs, CA
562-777-2480
robert@robertshoning.com

We are your one stop shop for Gundrilling, Trepanning and Honing. Capabilities... GUN DRILLING Knee-Type and Cylindrical from .055" to 3" TREPANNING From 2" to 6" HONING From .062 to 16" I.D.

Timken Boring
14730 Yarberry Street
Houston, TX
281-449-0319
TMS.CRM@TIMKENSTEEL.COM

Timken Boring can handle a wide variety of boring and trepanning needs on everything from basic carbon and alloy steels all the way through stainless and exotic alloys.

Tube Hollows
39 Enterprise Drive #2
Windham, ME
844-721-8823
espoerl@tubehollows.com

We at Tube Hollows International take pride in tackling jobs that others decline. Whether it's producing a 9 foot bar with a .200" hole down the center (a 540:1 depth to ID ratio) or drilling refractory bars made of molybdenum and tungsten or machining aerospace shafts with complex external features, we combine Yankee ingenuity and work ethic to get the job done right. Contact us to learn more about how we can help you achieve your unique, precision tube design goals.

Xact Spec Industries
16959 Munn Rd
Chagrin Falls, OH
(440) 543-8157
info@xactspec.com

Xact Spec is a leading provider of gun drilling, trepanning and spade drilling—reliable methods of drilling short and deep holes with excellent burr- and chip-free finishes. Xact Spec is capable of drilling holes with diameters of .055” to 16” up to 60 feet in length using high pressure oil. Close tolerance gun drilling with multiple shapes is available, including off-center holes, angled holes and connecting holes. We drill holes that are straight within .001 per inch; and can work pieces up to 60,000 lbs.